CC19 Rigging for Idjets - Q2 - Lazy Jacks/Topping Lift

[Norman Sanders]

This is the second in a series of questions that I've not been able to resolve by searching the forum.

The CC19 manual refers to "Lazy Jacks" which "act as a Topping Lift".

I know what Lazy Jacks are, but the line the manual describes sounds (and looks) more like a Topping Lift than any version of Lazy Jacks I've ever seen.

1. The manual says that this line is "tied to the mid boom lazy jack single horn cleat, going up through a shackle (aft of the single throat halyard block at the hounds fitting on the mast) and back down to the boom, where it is cleated off at the same cleat". If I am correctly understanding this, one end of this line is tied off on the cleat on the starboard side of the boom, passes up through the shackle, and then comes back down to be tied off on the very same starboard cleat. That makes no sense to me, since, among other reasons, it has a double tying of a thickish amount of line on a single cleat. I could understand it being tied off to the identical cleat on the port side of the boom, but my understanding is that one (there are two) are for use for reefing lines. Have I understood this concept correctly and, if so rigged, 1) does it actually help in flaking the main when it is lowered (typically, the purpose of Lazy Jacks), 2) does it actually stay tied when sailing with both ends on the same cleat, and 3) where do you tie it off when the thing is actually used as a Topping Lift?

2. This line was not fitted to my boat - or rather, there was a line through that shackle, but the ends were simply tied together, so it was just in the way.

Your advice will be much appreciated.

S.

[bellalistair]

You are right in that it is rather a hybrid of the two being both and neither, but it works for our purpose though as you will have seen many have replaced it with a more substantial lazyjacks arrangement led to a clutch to give better function and ease of adjustment.

As for the fixing, the description is not great, standard arrangement seems to be a 'permanent' bowline around a base of the cleat then pass the line under the boom to the other side before heading mastwards, on returning the it then makes off as normal to the cleat.

Same securing arrangements for both usages, essentially just loosen once the sail is up and tighten before dropping.

Alistair

[Norman Sanders]

Thank you, Alistair, I follow your description and will try it that way. Thanks very much.

[cc19uk]

Hi Norman,

On our boat we rig the lazy jacks with port side threaded through the mid-boom cleat and have a stopper knot (quick release shackle might be better).The starboard side is cleated-off to identical cleat on starboard side. In this way the port cleat can still be used by a reefing line if needed, and lazy jack adjusted from starboard side.
Re flaking of the main. They do help in this regard but are not foolproof, we still do a fair amount of manual tidying when reefing or lowering the main. They do prevent (most of) the mainsail from ‘escaping’ the realms of the boom though.

When acting as a topping lift (e.g. when moored and keeping the boom out the way) we move both ends to aft cleats on the boom. I can’t recall if we added cleats for this purpose or whether they came as spec from supplier. Ditto re the mid-boom cleats actually - we may have duplicated what was on one side only. When used as topping lift for reefing purposes they stay mid-boom.

Hope this helps a bit, there are likely many other ways of doing it. Incidentally I’m planning on replacing lazy jacks with double Barton ones once I’ve figured out the mast-top configuration (I don’t want two separate attachments aloft as Barton suggests, but would like to run the system to cockpit control instead of having to stand in cockpit to adjust at the boom).

Regards
Brendan

[Chris Wicks]

I can only add that we have never modified our lazy jack/ topping lift arrangement. Our single line is fixed with a stopper knot through one boom horn cleat which then loops through a single block at the mast fitting and back down the other side of the sail and fixed with a stopper knot after passing through the opposite side horn cleat. Depending on if I am on the port or starb'd side when wanting to fasten the topping lift I fasten the convenient end of the topping lift to it's appropriate horn cleat. We use our boat most days in the long summer, we reef frequently and normally sail on and off the mooring. I understand anyone wishing to enhance the standard set up, but I have never found the standard arrangement inconvenient or in particular need of improvement. I have no argument with those who disagree.

Happy sailing

Chris

[Norman Sanders]

Thank you all for your helpful replies. I did my first "sea trial" yesterday, and with one exception, the arrangement you all sketched out worked fine. Except when sailing. The lazy jack interfered with the gaff spar and I wound up unfastening from the boom and tying the ends to each other at the base of the mast while under sail.

Every rigging instruction I had gotten from the previous owner was either wrong, or not fully right. According to the line specifications provided by a helpful source elsewhere on the forum, the line being used for the lazy jacks is about 1.5 meters shorter than specification. I'm think that this may be enough to account for the interference, as the jacks aren't lazy, they are taut.

To be continued.

Thank y'all.

S.

[Chris Wicks]

Our lazy jack's are definitely lazy, and of the standard length. I think standard line lengths are noted somewhere on the forum. I helped a friend rig his recently purchased CC19 last year. The were some interesting modifications especially shortening every line to the absolute minimum. So the sail furler could not give several extra wraps of the jankee when not in use. The sheets were too short. The clonking centre plate was cured by taking one loop off the reel. Now it seats itself against the forward edge of the centre board case on no longer clinks whilst sailing. Frustratingly having sorted out my friends boat he is now faster than me. (Go Eliza Nell!)Not to worry but be generous with your sheets, halyards and lazy jack's.